Gross: I heard there was a deal on the table for you to re-sign with the UFC but it was contingent upon you apologizing. Is that true?

Penn: Yes, that is very true.

Gross: Who demanded that you apologize and who were you supposed to apologize to?

Penn: It was demanded that I say I’m sorry to all the fans. That I let them down, and this and that. And let down the UFC and that I know I made a mistake and now I know that. It was a mistake leaving and now I know it was a mistake.

Gross: So this was supposed to be a public apology. It wasn’t behind closed doors to [UFC President] Dana (White) or anything like that?

Penn: Yeah, strictly public apology. I mean if would have done it I would have been on “The Ultimate Fighter” season two probably with Hughes now, and this and that. Getting my face out there. But, yeah, that’s how it goes. That’s how things are. Everything happens for a reason. But I’m sure things will work its way out later and I think I’ll be fighting in the UFC one day.

Gross: Are there any regrets? Obviously apologizing, it’s not something you want to do or be forced into. Unless you really mean it, there’s no point, right?

Penn: If I really meant it then I’d do it in a second. “Hey man, I’m really sorry for leaving. This and that.” But I don’t really believe it, so why am I going to go out and do it? If Dana wants to feel that he saves face that way, then that’s how he feels and that’s his business. And if I feel that I want to save face my way, then that’s my business. I’m not going to go up there and do something that I don’t believe I should be doing just to get my face on TV and do this and this and that. And basically just give up everything, trying to take my manhood asking me to do something I don’t believe is right.

Gross: So why do you feel — I mean it sounds like there is, maybe animosity is not the right word, but there is still hard feelings — why do you feel that one day you’ll be back in the UFC?

Penn: I don’t think it’s hard feelings. Of course, everybody knows how Dana is on a professional level when he gets mad. A lot of decisions from him are made emotionally. But it still is business and I think business-wise we will be in there again. We just keep winning our fights. We keep learning our things. We keep growing as a fighter. Getting my name out there. I’m still doing things. This next show will be shown in 60 countries around the world. We’re the main event, the first time a mixed martial arts fight has been in any kind of [K-1] Grand Prix. We’re the main event. We probably won’t be huge on pay-per-view in the U.S., but the hardcore fans will probably watch it. So we’re still getting our name out there a little. But in the other countries we’re blasting our name out there. My last fight with Lyoto wasn’t shown on TV. It was a lackluster fight. But the Ludwig fight was shown on TV. So we’re pushing. We’re getting our name out there.